I wouldn't pay that much for a dog either. My poor pure-bred lab is dying of cancer and has suffered horrible arthritis for years. We got her from a rescue. The breeder dropped her off because she was "around 3 years old" and "used up". They said either take or we kill her. That was 8 years ago.
:(

Sorry, got a little off topic...

Ok I breed min pins and my male and female have not had problems yet. But this topic got way off from what I intended. I just wanted some pictures.

Back on topic, thank you for sharing the pictures. They are very beautiful gliders.

I agree Tortie...what gorgeous gliders! Precious is so cute!

If people would rather adopt and take in gliders from rescues, etc...that's great...go for it. I did...all 4 of mine were rehomed to me & they are the coolest gliders ever! But I am getting a joey in about 6 weeks or so and this will be the first glider that I paid a good chunk of change for, from a breeder.

By the way "ugly patchy glider" is suuuuch a nice description of Mosaics. Ppfft..Mo's are one of my fav color variation gliders...and would love to own one one day....but yes, at their going price now? Can't do it. They are gorgeous (ok as are ALL gliders). For Kaz to call them ugly and patchy?? I disagree.

Okay Godsend is the cutest i've seen in a while. I want him. lol

I have to agree with GoddessKitty, GODSEND IS SOOO CUTE!!
if I could get a glider like that I would! lol.

I still love the leus tho, I even love the albinos!!! lol.

Sheesh!!!! In breeding for colours in my opinion is wrong and purely done for selfish reasons. Making money from Gliders when their are so many that need rehoming is just inresponsable. I don't agreee with inbreeding dogs or cats either.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jett</i>
<br />Sheesh!!!! In breeding for colours in my opinion is wrong and purely done for selfish reasons. Making money from Gliders when their are so many that need rehoming is just inresponsable. I don't agreee with inbreeding dogs or cats either.


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???

No one here is inbreeding their gliders for colors. I don't know where some of the members here are getting the idea that all colored gliders MUST have been inbred. I'm sorry, but that's just not the case.

Look, here's Milky Way's lineage: justforfuzzies.com/pedigrees/MilkyWay_pedi.html

He's a leucistic and is NOT inbred or even linebred. He's got a 100% clean lineage!

Here's Gil, my mosaic boy: justforfuzzies.com/pedigrees/Gilthanas_pedi.html

Again, he is NOT inbred.

Please, do not make assumptions based on rumors. Most breeders post their lineages right on their websites, myself included. We have nothing to hide.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by stepakapets101</i>
<br />I have to agree with GoddessKitty, GODSEND IS SOOO CUTE!!
if I could get a glider like that I would! lol.

I still love the leus tho, I even love the albinos!!! lol.
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Thanks you guys! He's my little Godsend(literally). That's why I chose that name!

Now, if only he would love me as much as I love him... He's got the biggest attitude of any joey I've EVER had! I think he knows that he can get away with anything with me.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Tortiebaby</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jett</i>
<br />Sheesh!!!! In breeding for colours in my opinion is wrong and purely done for selfish reasons. Making money from Gliders when their are so many that need rehoming is just inresponsable. I don't agreee with inbreeding dogs or cats either.


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???

No one here is inbreeding their gliders for colors. I don't know where some of the members here are getting the idea that all colored gliders MUST have been inbred. I'm sorry, but that's just not the case.

Look, here's Milky Way's lineage: justforfuzzies.com/pedigrees/MilkyWay_pedi.html

He's a leucistic and is NOT inbred or even linebred. He's got a 100% clean lineage!

Here's Gil, my mosaic boy: justforfuzzies.com/pedigrees/Gilthanas_pedi.html

Again, he is NOT inbred.

Please, do not make assumptions based on rumors. Most breeders post their lineages right on their websites, myself included. We have nothing to hide.
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I'm sure not all of us believe that ALL of them are inbred. XD

I guess i got the idea that gliders have been inbred for colours because we don't have coloured gliders in Australia! If coloured gliders occur naturally why don't we see that here?

First off - I know nothing about lineages or breeding; so I'm just asking a question. Don't misinterpret as anything but that. But didn't <i>the very first </i> leus, mos, etc. have to be inbred?

Perhaps I am misinterpreting this thread?
http://www.glidercentral.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/630224/1

I think we should take a trip to Tortiebabys house to learn more about colored gliders.

Responsible breeders will post a lineage, but not all of them do. Some people like to play with their imaginations too, and make up a lineage, because you can put anything on a website. Tortiebaby I am not doubting you or your breeding practices. I don't think you become well-known in the community doing things wrong. I just know that there are less than reputable people out there that see dollar signs, not gliders.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">No one here is inbreeding their gliders for colors. I don't know where some of the members here are getting the idea that all colored gliders MUST have been inbred. I'm sorry, but that's just not the case.
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Sorry but coloured gliders have been bred that way by breeding the mutations with others with the mutation and this occurs purely by inbreeding in the first place by placing gliders from the same family lines that throw those mutations. What this does is also to breed any defects along with them making them more proned to deceases and organ deformities down the track. Just because you aren't breeding family memebers now by no means does that mean that your gliders aren't inbred. Sorry guys but that is where members on this forum get their information it's a fact!

so one time..I was watching animal planet (love that station), and their was a show about white bengal tigers. In the documentary, the man said that there are no natural occuring white tigers in the wild and that the white bengal tiger is a result of inbreeding. He said the more white tigers bred, the worse it is for the tiger species as a whole. Maybe this backs up the glider color inbreeding thing????? I dont know I just thought I would throw it out there.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Jett</i>
<br />I guess i got the idea that gliders have been inbred for colours because we don't have coloured gliders in Australia! If coloured gliders occur naturally why don't we see that here?
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In the wild, animals that look different(especially little prey animals) are usually killed off first because they don't blend. If there was an owl looking to snack on a glider, which would they go for first, the gray one that blends in or the white one that sticks out like a sore thumb?

Supposedly some of the original leus/mosaics were wild-caught...I've heard older breeders say otherwise and yet those gliders are still listed in databases as being wild-caught. The only people who would know for sure are the ones who bought them and, unfortunately, I don't think they'll be all to eager to come down here and tell us.

Sooo...we go by the lineages we have and are careful to pair gliders that are unrelated or distantly-related enough to be considered unrelated.

Some colors, such as mosaics, do not need to be paired with other mosaics to produce mosaic babies, thus there is no need to inbreed or linebreed because you can pair them with grays and they'll still have mosaic babies. Same with the WFs.

Unfortunately there ARE some bad breeders that did severe inbreeding, such as with 1 of the mosaic lines. Even though you do not have to pair mosaics, they did it anyways and the inbreeding was so extreme, that the male offspring because sterile. That is why you see so many "sterile" or "possibly sterile" gliders. : My opinion is that those gliders should not be bred, but that's a whole different topic...

Yes, there ARE bad breeders who will lie to get what they want, such as Mike McGrath(the worst of the worst!) but for the most part breeders are NOT bad people. You just have to do your research, just as if you were buying any other kind of animal.

Jett...how much do you know about breeding? Or breeding the color variation gliders? Just because you live in Australia, doesn't make you the end all be all expert on colored gliders and whether they are ALL inbred. Tortie SHOWED you that her lines are clean...and you're basically calling her out on it? What does she gain by lying about her gliders lines?

If you want to be a rescue/rehome advocate...please, go right ahead...they all need good homes. But in all honesty? If someone here wants to shell out a thousand dollars for a glider that is a color variation...who are you to tell them it's wrong? It's their money...these colored gliders do need good homes too. Its a matter of opinion....plain and simple.

OK, the original question was who had them and that she wanted to see pics. Why do people want to argue about in-breeding? There are different species of different animals. Some occur naturally, some don't. No one can say for sure where they started from unless you were on the earth when the first two gliders mated and followed it from them. Scientific theories are just that, theories. There is always a gray are, that is why they are theories and not facts. Can't we all just get along and see more pictures of the babies?

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by smushandrocky</i>
<br />There are some seriously misinformed posts on here (i.e. Kazko and Snusie).

Sugar glider breeders are a pretty small community and I can promise you that no one kills gliders because of their color.

Leucism is a recessive trait that results in extremely reduced coat pigment (an almost white appearance). Both parents have to be carriers in order for the glider to be leucistic. If it is heterozygous (meaning that it only got the leucistic trait from one parent), then it will appear as a classic grey. So the notion that you have to get 5 ugly spotted ones to get one white is not only wrong, but ridiculously wrong. Here is one of my leucistics.
<center> </center>
Speaking of those ugly spotted ones...Mosaic gliders are ones with random coat variations resulting from a dominant mutation. Mosaic gliders can inherit the trait from just one parent and still look like a mosaic, hence the dominance of the mutation. These are as prized as much as leucistic gliders if not more so for their extraordinary coat variations. Breeding mosaics is a special treat because you never know what kind of coat variety you will get. Here is a pic of my favorite mosaic.
<center> </center>

There are, of course, unscrupulous individuals out there that inbreed animals to the point of harm. This is done in dog, cat, horse, reptile, etc. breeding. Breeders who inbreed should be avoided. Of course, just about all the sugar gliders in captivity can be traced back to a few ancestors, so everyone is somewhat related if only remotely. A good sugar glider breeder will be able to provide you with all the lineage you need to be sure that your glider is not seriously inbred.

Try to be informed and remember that if someone posts something hateful or inflammatory without the information and resources to back up their claims, they are probably dead wrong and just looking for attention.

cheers!

smushandrocky
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You do realise that this is almost 2 years old, right?

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by smushandrocky</i>
<br />There are some seriously misinformed posts on here (i.e. Kazko and Snusie).

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You are a little late!

http://www.sugarglider.com/glidergossip/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=30059

how do these ridiculously old posts get dug up?

and a ton more.. but I love these..

hahaha.. I just realized the original date on the post.... just thought I had a chance a chance to post pics of my girls..

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by smushandrocky</i>
<br />
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You do realise that this is almost 2 years old, right?
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Indeed, this is an old post. However, it comes right up if you google leucistic sugar glider. I think it's important for us to take the time to correct as much of the misinformation that surrounds these lovable little guys.
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Catman's point was you are telling someone that has passed away that they have incorrect info and she was an extreme asset to this community. Maybe you're better off just stating what info you feel is incorrect if you're going to post on a post that's this old.

Wouldn't this information be better served in the Gliderpedia, where it can be accessed at all times and not just when someone happens upon a years old post? Just a thought.

jakeelwood, you have the prettiest leu I've ever seen! I'm always so awed by that coat!

My hate? Mmmmmmk.